Jim Geckler | From Active Addiction to CEO
In this episode of 12 Geniuses, host Don MacPherson interviews Jim Geckler, CEO of the Harmony Foundation in Estes Park, Colorado. Jim bravely and candidly shares his transformative journey from battling active addiction to leading a renowned treatment center, offering invaluable insights into leadership, change, and emotional intelligence.
Key Lessons for Global Business Leaders:
Embracing Personal Transformation: Jim's narrative underscores the power of personal change, illustrating how overcoming significant personal challenges can lead to profound professional growth.
Leading with Empathy and Emotional Intelligence: Jim’s experiences highlight the importance of understanding and compassion in leadership, emphasizing that emotional intelligence is crucial in guiding teams through disruption and change.
How addiction is a powerful barrier for reaching one’s potential: Jim journey from rock bottom to becoming an executive illustrates how devastatingly powerful addiction is in preventing people from performing at their highest levels.
Guidance for spotting people at risk: By fostering an environment that prioritizes support and trust, Jim demonstrates how leaders can cultivate resilience and adaptability within their organizations.
Advice for dealing with employees or family members struggling with addiction : Lies, slipping grades, late assignments, and abnormal behavior are a few of the warning signs that Jim says are important signals that someone might be struggling or on the precipice of addiction. It’s important these signs are addressed and not ignored.
About 20 million people in the United States have substance abuse problems and 72,000 Americans lost their lives from drug overdoses in 2017. The chances are you have a family member, a friend, a work colleague, or neighbor who struggles with addiction.
This episode offers a profound exploration of how personal adversity can inform and enhance leadership capabilities, providing global business leaders with actionable insights into managing change, fostering emotional intelligence, and leading with courage in the face of disruption.
Don MacPherson
If you have ever wondered what separates top performers from everyone else, you probably discovered it is just a couple differentiators that determine wild success from average results. My name is Don MacPherson, and for two decades, I've been working with executives to help them optimize performance at the individual, team, and organization levels. Now I interview exceptional performers in athletics, music, entertainment, and business, so we can all learn from them. Welcome to 12 Geniuses.
Have you heard about the opioid epidemic in the United States? More than 72,000 people lost their lives from drug overdoses in 2017 and more than two thirds of those deaths involved opioids. Our guest today is Jim Geckler. Jim is CEO of Harmony Foundation, an addiction recovery center in Estes Park, Colorado. In the first part of the interview, Jim shares his background and his personal journey of recovery. In part two of the interview, Jim gives advice to those who are afflicted with addiction, and he gives recommendations for friends, relatives, coworkers, and supporters of someone who is struggling with addiction.
Jim, welcome to 12 Geniuses.
Jim Geckler
How’re you doing, Don?
Don MacPherson
I'm doing great. It's a pleasure to be here today. We have known each other for a long time.
Jim Geckler
We sure have.
Don MacPherson
15 or 16 years.
Jim Geckler
Yep.
Don MacPherson
And you have a remarkable story to tell. And I would like you to tell that today in part one of our interview here. So, if maybe you could describe what you were doing from a career perspective from the day we met through today.
Jim Geckler
Sure. Well, when we met, it was 15 or 16 years ago at least. I was living in a halfway house and I was a barista for a coffee shop at the Mall of America. I was relatively new to recovery. I'd been sober for about two years and was figuring some things out and I needed a place to live. And you had an apartment in the Uptown Area of Minneapolis. I knew someone who was living there and I moved in with them. Then they moved out and I stayed. And I think you were my legal landlord for probably six years, six, seven years. I was a barista for a while and became a manager pretty quickly, ran that coffee shop for a while. One of the great things that we had there was I was able to recruit from sober houses, halfway houses, the sober high schools that used to exist in Minneapolis-Saint Paul.
And had a real strong foundation for people in early recovery who would come and work there. There's a woman who was 16 when I hired her. And she's a mom now and a yoga instructor. There's a young man who was in a halfway house who's now a surgeon living in Boston. People who really took the opportunity for recovery and launched it. I was getting ready to go back to school and become a counselor. I was going to be a substance use counselor. And they have an excellent program at the Hazelden Betty Ford Foundation. And I was lined up to do that. I had made some changes at work, so I would be able to continue to work and go back and forth to Center City. I wasn't in a point where I could go to school full-time and not work.
And I was actually at a church pancake breakfast with a group of friends. This is pre-cellphone, kind of text that we have now, and I opened my store late. And because I opened my store late, I was terminated. They had a no-tolerance policy for that. I called my boss. I went out, when I finally got out there, at the time I thought I was supposed to be there, I called my boss, and she came out and I had opened the store and gotten things running and realized what was going to happen. I went to a meeting that night. Yeah, I'm in recovery. And my recovery community's important to me. I went to a meeting and said, “I don't know what I'm going to do. I just lost my job and my whole world just turned upside down.”
I was approached by a guy who was opening an LGBT sober house in Minneapolis. And he hired me. While it was still about 15 years ago, $500 a month is not a livable wage, so I needed to find some other things to do too. And I was working part-time at a gym and I kind of stumbled across this job. I interviewed to answer the phones at night at an intervention and family consulting business, and fell in love with it. Fell in love with the work of talking to families who are in deep crisis and helping them move through it, and find solutions for the people that they loved. I did that for about six and a half years. And in that time, I moved in that company from answering the phones to director of their admissions group and their phone bank, to director of operations, to vice president of operations.
And also got married in that time period. And, sadly, left your house, bought a house up in the middle of nowhere, Minnesota, right near the Hazelden Foundation. And was approached by, at that time, the executive director of that location who invited me to come and work for them. It was a huge honor. So, I went to work for Hazelden. I was there for just under seven years also. And had a variety of roles that I had there from director of outreach. My final position was director of patient alumni and community relations. I was visiting a former colleague out here in Colorado in Estes Park at Harmony, and who is our chief clinical officer, Dr. Annie Peters. And we had come out to see a Devotchka Show one year for Halloween.
And they were looking for a chief operating officer. So, I threw my hat in the ring and went through about two months of interviewing and came out in early December 2 years ago, almost three years ago now. And interviewed with the board of directors and was very honored to be offered that job. So, in February of 2016, we moved out to Colorado and bought a house that's surrounded by elk and moose and bear on occasion and started working here at Harmony.
Don MacPherson
And you came out here as COO.
Jim Geckler
Yeah.
Don MacPherson
And you have now taken over the CEO role.
Jim Geckler
Last July, so I've been in this role for 14 months.
Don MacPherson
Yeah. It's a remarkable journey over that 15 or 16 years that we've known each other, going from barista to CEO of a recovery center. Can you talk about what you were doing prior to the day we met?
Jim Geckler
Sure. So, I started using drugs and alcohol when I was about 13 years old. I grew up in Western New York and was… I know the moment that I fell in love with drugs and alcohol, I was on the swing set at the Kenan Center in Lockport. And this woman who I was working on a play with asked me if I got high. I was 13.
Don MacPherson
How old was she?
Jim Geckler
She was probably 17 or 18.
Don MacPherson
Okay.
Jim Geckler
And I drank a Heineken and split a joint with her, and I was off to the races. My parents are good, educated, loving people who had no idea what to do with this kid that was manipulative, and bright, and using, and dishonest, and all of these things. So, they did their best, but I just kept going. I used extensively through high school into multiple colleges. And eventually, in a large blow up, came to Minnesota in 1996 to go to treatment. Did treatment, did not stay sober. Did another bit, did not stay sober. And things got really bad. At this point, I was injecting cocaine and crystal meth. I had stopped talking to my family. My brother is a narcotics detective, which the irony of that never escapes anyone.
And I was desperate. I was desperate and didn't know what else to do. And this guy that I was using with, we committed a series of robberies and I was arrested. And just before I met you, I was getting out of prison. So, in my disease, had committed a series of robberies, and I paid the price and did time for that. I did about three years in prison in Minnesota. During that time, I did treatment for a full year. And that really was a great experience. There, we talk about a spiritual awakening that happens for people in recovery and hitting their bottom. That clearly, for me, I can remember laying on the ground in Brooklyn Center, Minnesota, and being grateful for really the first time in a very, very long time.
Don MacPherson
Why were you grateful?
Jim Geckler
That it was over. I didn't know what was going to happen next, but I knew I didn't have to do what I was doing anymore. I'd like to say that, that feeling stayed with me, and I've been grateful since February 5th of 1999, but there are moments where I'm not. There are moments in early recovery where I thought about using again, where I had plans about using, but following what has worked for me, which is a 12-step program, I was able to build a community and build support people around me who could help with things like that.
Don MacPherson
When you were in Brooklyn Center or Brooklyn Park, and you had that moment where you became grateful, were you in prison at that time?
Jim Geckler
Oh, no. I was laying on the street surrounded by police officers.
Don MacPherson
Really? So, that was when you were arrested?
Jim Geckler
That's when I was arrested.
Don MacPherson
Okay. When you were in your high school years, what were you using? You said you experimented with a beer and a joint when you were 13, and how did it progress from there?
Jim Geckler
It progressed pretty rapidly. I went to a very small high school. I graduated with seven people. I actually love that your podcast is called 12 Geniuses. The irony is not lost on me. I went to a school for gifted children. And, in my class of seven, I believe three of us are in recovery. There was a lot of drug use, a lot of privilege. The drinking age was 18 when I was in high school, so by the time I was a senior, I could go to bars. Our school was surrounded by colleges. I had done every drug I would do except for crystal meth and heroin before I graduated from high school. Did fair amount of acid, mushrooms, cocaine.
Don MacPherson
And it was all accessible.
Jim Geckler
It was all accessible.
Don MacPherson
Okay. And then, when did you start to use crystal meth?
Jim Geckler
Probably, well, it was in Washington, DC. I was there for a march and I ran into someone that I had known from Buffalo, who was no longer living there. I was looking for cocaine, and he said, “I don't have cocaine, but I have crystal meth.” And so, I did that. Every drug I have ever done, I have, I mean, this is one of those things, when people say, “I'm not sure if I'm an addict,” I have no question about it. Every drug I have ever done has been the solution to my problems at that time. That would've been early ‘90s, ‘90, ‘91, somewhere in there.
Don MacPherson
And you used crystal meth for how long? Until 99?
Jim Geckler
Until 99.
Don MacPherson
Okay. And was that really your drug of choice through that period?
Jim Geckler
Crystal meth and cocaine. During a period of time, I actually used crystal meth so I could stay awake so I could shoot more cocaine. When I talk about it now, you easily recognize the insanity of that behavior, but at the time, it was a great solution. It worked for me.
Don MacPherson
Yeah. You had a high school class of seven people. Certainly, teachers, administrators, fellow, students knew something was going on. What sort of actions were taken?
Jim Geckler
Very little. Very little.
Don MacPherson
It was a high tolerance?
Jim Geckler
It was a high tolerance. I remember we had a parent-student faculty meeting in my senior year where we wanted to be able to drink. And so, we had this discussion about it. I remember only one parent saying, “This is ridiculous, you’re children and we are adults. There are rules and you have to follow them.” There was this whole idea that, let's have dialogue and everyone… Which I think is, in its purest form, is great. But if you have a child who's hurting themselves, to sit back and say, “Well, this is part of the developmental stage,” is irresponsible.
Don MacPherson
There must have been a healthy amount of denial too.
Jim Geckler
Oh yeah. Yeah. And we were, I mean, young, so you bounce back quickly. We were all very smart so we were able to cover things up. We were all overachievers. So, things looked good on paper. I really don't think my folks knew about the drug use at all. They knew that I drank. My mother grew up in an alcoholic home, so she hated that. They knew that I drank, but I think they just turned an eye to the drug use.
Don MacPherson
February 5th, 1999.
Jim Geckler
Yep.
Don MacPherson
Was your first day being sober?
Jim Geckler
Yep.
Don MacPherson
And you've got 20 years coming up.
Jim Geckler
God willing. Yeah, if I make it, as long as… I only have coffee with me this morning, so it shouldn't be a problem. But yeah, this February, I hope to celebrate 20 years of continuous sobriety.
Don MacPherson
And what do you plan to do to celebrate?
Jim Geckler
It'll just be another day, just another 24 hours. In my first treatment in ‘96, there was a nurse who celebrated his birthday while we were in treatment, and he was in recovery. And he talked about how, in recovery, no day is more special than the other day. They're all the same. And expectations that tomorrow is going to be this amazing day because it's an anniversary or a birthday or Christmas are the kind of things that trip up people in recovery. So, it's just another day.
Don MacPherson
You had a couple of attempts at becoming sober or recovery. What was different about this one that stuck?
Jim Geckler
Yeah. One of the things that I carried around, and this was probably a message from childhood, was that I was one of the smartest people in the room. So, I thought I knew more than everyone else. I was filled with hubris and arrogance. And it was not that I'm completely cured of those two things, but I think I'm better. All of my outs were gone. All of the things, the ways I could manipulate a situation were gone. I honestly didn't know what to do next for the first time in my life. I gave up. And it was an incredibly freeing feeling. You hear this in lots of spiritual paths, you hear it in lots of recovery paths that, by letting go, it's the way that we actually get something. And I found that to be true.
Don MacPherson
Our guest is Jim Geckler, the CEO of Harmony Foundation. We've been talking about his personal journey from addiction to leading one of the most respected recovery centers in the United States. When we come back from this short break, we're going to talk about addiction in America, what addicts need to do in order to have a successful recovery, and what families and friends can do to support their loved ones, suffering from addiction.
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We are back with Jim Geckler. Jim, as you know, drug-related deaths have increased in America by more than three times between 2002 and 2017, and opioid-related deaths have skyrocketed. What are the primary reasons for these dramatic increases?
Jim Geckler
Well, the opioid epidemic, if we look at the roots of it, I think we're looking at the pharmaceutical companies and their marketing techniques, and the way that they work with physicians and prescribers to incentivize them, or they used to, to incentivize them to prescribe their medications. We had a talk yesterday, but I think it's important to repeat. America, as a whole, doesn't do well with pain. We don't know the difference between pain and discomfort, for most people. I twist my ankle, or right now I have a pinched nerve in my neck, and it has pain going across my shoulder and down my arm. It's pretty much constant pain. This flares up every, I don't know, 18 months or so. There are times where it's incredibly uncomfortable and there are times where it's just a numbness.
And when it first happened to me, I was like, this is the worst pain anyone has ever felt in the history of the world. I felt that I understood childbirth because I had this pain. And when I went to my doctor, they said, “Well, we can give you some oxycodone and that'll help with the pain.” Nobody, or very few people, actually need that level of pain medication. Everything that was happening to me was fixed through an anti-inflammatory and some visits to a chiropractor. So, if I had gone and followed the direction of my MD, who knew that I was a person living in recovery and still was suggesting opiates, who knows where I'd be today?
Don MacPherson
And that's fairly common, right? When somebody is prescribed something, their prescription runs out, and then they become hooked, and then they turn to other drugs. Is that an accurate statement?
Jim Geckler
Yep. Because with opiates, especially the withdrawal is so uncomfortable that people search out other drugs in order to numb that pain.
Don MacPherson
So, that's curious. There's this great withdrawal after a prescribed drug is given to a patient.
Jim Geckler
Correct, when it's been used for a period of time.
Don MacPherson
What is typically a period of time where somebody needs or will become an addict?
Jim Geckler
Well, that's a huge debate, a huge question.
Don MacPherson
Does it depend on that individual's predisposition toward addiction?
Jim Geckler
That's a big part of it. I mean, you have had drinks in your life and yet you're not an alcoholic. From the very first drink that I had; I was an alcoholic. I mean, I was going after it. Having been your neighbor, I know that you don't drink on a regular basis. In your 20s, there were probably times that you drank to excess, but it didn't make you an alcoholic. Same thing around medication. There are people that take pain meds that they may become dependent on them, but they're not addicted to them. And there's a difference.
Don MacPherson
How can healthcare professionals be more diligent in understanding that? Because you said your physician knew you were in recovery and still prescribed this. That seems like very poor practice from my opinion.
Jim Geckler
Well, it's what they know. I mean, I love medical professionals. I have often said that if I'm in a car accident, take me to an emergency room, not an AA meeting. There's a reason for pain medication. The problem is not the drug. The problem is the way the drug is administered. Most medical schools and most MDs and nurse practitioners have very little awareness of addiction. It's just not taught to them. Their job as a healthcare provider is to relieve pain, to diagnose the problem and fix the problem. I don't necessarily fault them for the position we're in. I think now, and this is the same conversation I would have with families when they were struggling. It's, you get a pass up till today, but now that we know what the problem is, we have to fix it. So, we can't continue to prescribe in this manner. And we are seeing a change, but we can't continue to prescribe in the manner we were, thinking that it's gonna work. We can't do the same thing over and over again, expecting different results.
Don MacPherson
I want to get back to this idea of discomfort versus pain. Can you talk about what the differences are or how somebody should be categorizing one from the other?
Jim Geckler
So, I was at a conference for, or a presentation that Dr. Mel Pohl from Las Vegas Recovery gave about two weeks ago, to benefit a program in Aspen called The Way Out, which does great work with folks who are indigent. We actually work with them very closely on getting people help who normally wouldn't be able to afford it. And Mel was talking about the pain scale that people have. So, if you go to your doctor and you've got a back pain or fibromyalgia, they usually say, “Where are you on the pain scale from one to 10?” And Mel was saying, most people come in and say they're at a 10 or a 12. A 10 is your arm has been ripped off. Or, as our medical director Dr. Chris Reveley likes to say, you have been tied to a tree and horses are pulling off all your limbs.
That's a 10. Most of us never experienced that, thankfully. That, for most of us, our pain is, when it's extreme, is maybe an 8. And having education around that is helpful. When we start treating people with pain, and we are not a pain clinic, we refer out to people who have chronic pain, but when we start working with people who say, “I have chronic pain, and I've been on opiates, I've been on benzodiazepines to help with this for years,” we help them look at where their pain is and the difference between pain and discomfort.
Don MacPherson
Let's go back to the opioid epidemic. What are some of the negative byproducts of that epidemic that some people might be, or most people might not be thinking about?
Jim Geckler
I think we tend to think about the person who's using the drug, and them solely, the person who's, whether it's drinking or opiates, whatever. The identified individual, if you will, who's… And it's their problem. What we don't always look at is the effect it has on the family, the effect it has on society, on the workplace, on safety in general. Someone who's using opioids on a regular basis usually has… I mean, what's the average family? Three or four people that are distracted at work because they're thinking about the identified individual and their drug use. If they're working, they're showing up impaired to work and not doing a great job.
So, it has that effect on society. Or they're not working, and they are breaking the law, or using public resources to continue their life. There's also the cost of healthcare and getting help. We tend to focus that Johnny is using oxycodone or Johnny is shooting heroin or drinking. And that's the problem where… And the only thing we need is for Johnny to change his life, and then everything will be perfect. And the reality is very different than that.
Don MacPherson
Let's talk about Harmony Foundation. Can you describe the model for treatment here?
Jim Geckler
Sure. So, we've been around since 1969. We're a 12-step-based program, which means that we use the approach that was created through Alcoholics Anonymous and then adopted by Narcotics Anonymous and Gambling Anonymous, and all the other 12-step programs that are out there. We use that as the core of our treatment. So, we introduced a spiritual path along with looking at people's medical and mental health needs. When we started in 1969, we adopted what's known as the Minnesota Model that was created in Minnesota, kind of polished and packaged by Hazelden Foundation. When folks first started coming here, their detox protocol was some vitamin B12 and sleep it off. Time has shown us that that's not the most effective way to help someone transition to recovery. Our goal here at Harmony, our mission is to build a foundation for people to address their substance use.
There is no great cure. There's no pill that you can take. There's no magic to 28 days. It is a long process for folks, but we want to start that here. And we built this foundation with the goal, for every single person who comes here, that they achieve abstinence and have a quality of life that's fantastic. Over a period of time, and some of this has happened rapidly in the last couple of years, we've expanded our mental healthcare. About four years ago, we had two mental health professionals on campus. Today, we have 12. Vast majority of the people who are coming to us are suffering with some mental health issue, whether it's trauma, anxiety, depression, something more chronic, and we stabilize them here. Again, what we really do is stabilization assessment and start the treatment process for people. We built that foundation.
Don MacPherson
Do you ever see people coming in who just are not ready? And if so, what do you do with those folks?
Jim Geckler
Yes. Yeah, there are people that show up for treatment. I think I probably saw more of this during intervention work. I was more aware of it during that period of time. And that certainly helped me for a lot of the conversations I have today. There are people who don't know, maybe they haven't hit their bottom, maybe they haven't seen consequences happen in their life to a degree that will cause them to want to make change. I think we make change when things become uncomfortable. And for some people, that can be getting a DUI is enough of a discomfort that they want to make change. For some people, it’s becoming homeless, getting HIV, prostituting themselves, committing crimes, whatever it might be. We have to pick a point that things are uncomfortable enough.
I think, and well, I know we're going to talk about families more, but there is an ability that we have, as family members, as people who love someone, to help raise that bottom. There are ways that we interact with people who are struggling, that in a normal situation look like help. But when we add addiction to the mix, it actually becomes enabling.
Don MacPherson
Let's talk about families. What are some of the early warning signs that a family member, brother, sister, child is headed down the addiction path?
Jim Geckler
Things that we see commonly are being caught in lies, slipping grades for students, behavior that is abnormal, that's being out all late, new groups of friends. There's a time that parents or loved ones, friends can step in and say, “Your well-being is more important to me than our relationship.” I think a lot of times we get paralyzed out of fear that if I talk to you about the way you show up, that you are not going to love me anymore, or you're going to disappear. And that is a reality. There are people, as I told you earlier, I’d cut my family off, and there are people that will do that and may walk away.
I think for the families, for the individuals, the friends, the loved ones, we have to decide if we want the disease in our life that way. In my recovery, I've had people who I love very much, who I've had to say, “I can't help you. What you're asking me to do will not help you, and I'm not willing to do that. I am willing to help you in the following ways.” And I've lost their friendships because of that.
Don MacPherson
When somebody is, without a doubt, certain that somebody in their family needs help, can you give some resources, or tools, or advice for how to approach that person and have a conversation with them?
Jim Geckler
Well, I think be honest. Part of it is to say… Be honest and own your piece. So, it's a very different conversation to say, “Sally, you're doing drugs and you're hanging out with the wrong crowd and we're not going to have that in my house.” Versus, “Sally, I see you doing these things, and this is the way it affects my decision-making. I love you so much. I can't allow you to continue to bring these friends that are obviously doing this behavior into my home.” Especially for parents, when you have someone who is, whether they're a minor or an adult who's living in your home and has behavior that's unacceptable to you, but you allow it to continue because of your love for the child, you're altering your moral window on what’s acceptable to you.
If you wouldn't let a stranger come into your house and smoke crack, why would you allow your child to do it? And yet, people continue to do that because of fear, which is normal. Resource-wise, there's a great book by Jeff and Debra Jay called Love First, that really does give people a good understanding of the intervention process. Please don't watch TV and think that, because I watched the Intervention show, I can do this on my own. I used to, and till tell families, I watch HGTV all the time, but you don't want me rewiring your house. Find a good clinically trained and licensed interventionist if you're at that point.
Don MacPherson
I want to get back to parents and family members. Do you think that it's a fair statement to say that most parents know that their son or daughter has a problem before help is ever requested? And if that is the case, I'm essentially describing denial here, what do you say to that parent who is hoping that this problem will go away on its own?
Jim Geckler
Well, it probably won't. I mean, if you think there's a problem, there's a problem. Even if your child isn't using to the level that you believe they are, if there's a problem in your home that's been created by drugs and alcohol, that you are having, then your family has a problem, and you need to find a way to address it. When you talk about parenting and warning signs., so I'm someone who should be savvy about drugs. I have a history of using, I've worked in this field for 16, 17 years now, 15 years. Math is hard, but I've worked in this field for a while.
There's a, a great exercise, and it's actually a trailer that's set up as a teenager's bedroom, and you walk through and take a look, and when you walk through, on the way out, you identify what could be connected to drugs. As a guy in my 50s, the bent soda can with holes in it, the hollowed-out apple, upon tinfoil, things like that are easily identifiable. I, quite honestly, don't know how bath salts are used. I don't know how kratom is used. And so, I would know, it could be on a table, in a room, and I would have no idea as a parent. So, get educated.
Don MacPherson
Let's talk about the individual who's struggling with addiction. What do you say to them when they're scared to reach out for help?
Jim Geckler
Well, the first thing is that there's a solution. You don't have to stay trapped in this. Once you have identified that you have a problem, it is a very, very lonely place to be. And you don't need to live like that anymore. There's a community. There are other people who are willing to support you. There are people who struggle with 12-step programs because of the spiritual component. There are a lot of ways to recovery. I am a strong advocate for 12-step. That's what saved my life, but I know that there are people that the message there doesn't speak to them. And I would say, “Don't stop looking.”
Don MacPherson
One of the things that I have seen is that virtual reality is being used as a tool to defer or delay when a patient will take their pain medication. I wanted to ask you about new technologies that are being introduced to the recovery community and to your work here at Harmony, or at other centers that well, are giving you hope for being effective tools in helping patients.
Jim Geckler
Well, one of the major solutions to addiction, one of the big pieces in treatment is connection. We talk about addiction as a disease of isolation. And when people enter recovery, we want to help them be connected with people. Here, at the Harmony Foundation, we get a lot of clients from very remote areas of Wyoming, and Nebraska, and Southern Colorado, who may not have access to community, ranchers who are really out there by themselves. And we are using technology to allow for virtual connections. So, if I'm living in remote Wyoming, I can log on to a daily meeting of alumni who are connecting with one of our clinicians. It's still new in development, but it's been very well received as a way of keeping people connected.
Don MacPherson
What about wearables? We talked about this a little bit yesterday when we were touring through Rocky Mountain National Park, which is fantastic. It was beautiful.
Jim Geckler
It was closed today, so we were-
Don MacPherson
Oh, we were so lucky. Thank you for doing that, by the way. But what about wearables as a technology to help people be held accountable or to monitor usage, any progress going on there?
Jim Geckler
There are some case management tools around GPS locations more than… There may very well, and I'm sure I'll get a call if there are, be tools that are out there right now that measure blood pressure, things like that. I mean, certainly for people with alcohol issues, the DUI courts for a long time have demanded for the breathalyzer starts for a car, so I can't start a car. There's a personal breathalyzer by a company called Soberlink, which takes a photograph of people and has their GPS. So, you can see where they're doing it. Those, as we talked about, have allowed for earlier intervention, because if I'm… I could be presenting a clean breathalyzer every single day.
But if the photograph shows that I'm holding the breathalyzer while someone else is blowing into it, it provides a greater accountability. I'm excited at the opportunity that some of these things will have. I think technology is going to revolutionize what we do because medications like Antabuse, or even Buprenorphine, which helps support people in early recovery, or Vivitrol, if there's a noninvasive version of that, that comes out through technology, I think that'll be very well received.
Don MacPherson
Jim, this has been a great conversation, and I really appreciate you taking the time out to have it. Where can people find out more about you and about Harmony Foundation?
Jim Geckler
Well, I'm all over the internet. There's another James Geckler, so don't google him. He's a distant cousin who also works in this field. He's a great guy.
Don MacPherson
Really? Okay.
Jim Geckler
Yes. Lives in Pennsylvania and is a therapist. But if you google Jim Geckler, I'm there. They can call the harmony Foundation. They can reach out to us at harmonyfoundationinc dot com. And I know we'll put a link on the resource page. Yeah, I just want to encourage folks, if you're listening and this connects with you in some way, reach out for help. There's a lot of help available. There's no shame in asking for help. It's actually, I think, I'm most proud of people and have the greatest admiration for them when they reach out for help.
Don MacPherson
Well, thank you for that. And Jim, I'm very proud to be your friend and very proud to know you. You sharing your story about your personal journey and your recovery, I'm sure, will give people a lot of hope who are struggling with this disease, and you have given great advice, great tips for family members, for coworkers, for friends of people who are struggling. And I think one of the main things that people need when they're struggling through times like this is hope, and I think that's what your story has given us today. So, thank you so much.
Jim Geckler
Well, thank you.
Don MacPherson
And thank you for being a genius.
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